Should these happy campers be 'forced' into caravan parks?
While increasing numbers of grey nomads are looking to spend at least some of their time on the road free camping, there is a growing and concerted effort by some organisations to restrict their opportunities to do so.
The New South Wales Crown Holiday Parks Trust – which oversees the operation of 36 coastal and inland holiday parks and several recreation reserves on Crown Land – is the latest to add its voice to those calling for a crackdown.
The organisation’s CEO, Steve Edmonds, said free campers were costing commercial parks a small fortune.
“Holiday parks have invested in significant infrastructure and pay for professional management,” Mr Edmonds told the Northern Star newspaper. “Whenever a potential visitor uses the free option instead, it denies holiday park managers and owners the business they have worked hard for.”
The Trust believes the solution is for organisations such as Caravan & Camping Industry Association NSW and councils across the state to work together to ensure free camping is controlled.
Mr Edmonds also told the Northern Star that he opposed the idea that these free campers contributed to the local economy.
“It is well documented that paying holiday park guests spend $1.39 in the local economy for every $1 spent in the park,” he said.
The owner of Byron Holiday Park, Michelle Bourke, says hers is one of the businesses hit hard by free camping, and she commonly has lots of free sites.
She told the Northern Star she could be making another $3000 per night just in the off season if more free campers used her facilities.
“We pay taxes, we pay water rates, we pay everything through the council and I know the council is trying as hard as they can to get these people to go into licensed premises but it’s not working at the moment,” she said. “We cannot let it get like New Zealand where there are just people pulling up everywhere, they’ve lost control of it.”
Once again they are complaining about free camping. Why don’t they actually ask grey nomads why they aren’t getting the business. Removing powered sites for cabins are charging like a wounded bull for jumping pillows etc doesn’t make sense. Try setting up an area where there are no facilities other than showers and toilets and see what happens
Have a look at the ‘caravan and motorhome club’ site in the UK and see how a small business such as a pub farm golf course can have a small site with a max of 5 units and supplying limited facilities all vetted by the club and at low cost. In this great land with space to spare the UK system would be wonderful for travellers
The answer to your question is NO. On top of that I have no desire to be jam packed in caravan parks when I can manage in free camps with nature all around me.
I agree
Agree, not always about $$, hate being crammed in hearing every move your neighbour makes! We live on an acre, might as well be home!!!
Totally understand why people are not staying there as $50 to park your van there per night is ludicrous. “Byron” is backpackers paradise have absolutely no desire to revisit. Unless a park clearly states whether or not you can have your dog at no extra fee we will not book in. Not make a limit on under 10kg dogs
Goodness what a short sighted person who thinks those of us who like to go to the places where there is freedom or bush camping is primarilt not about money but about more space less rules and regulations and dissliking paying for services no longer required.
Well said!
Choice is fundamental in our society.
Perhaps the CP owners have a flawed business model if they need to FORCE people to use their product to survive.
We have always used CPs but are becoming increasingly restrained by the very high CP prices that we are encountering, particularly on the East Coast.
We intend to use some ‘free camps’ on our next trip, for the first time in 20 years of vanning. WHY . Because of the crazy price of CPs with all their, for us, unused jumping pillows, swimming pools, mini golf etc etc.
We just want a safe place to camp with power & water at a reasonable price.
This push by greedy or inept business people will not succeed.
Spot on,well said
No way could we afford to do the Big Lap, or even a part circle, if we had to pay the charges every night that these sites want, particularly after having bought a vehicle that is fully self contained and self sufficient, and only needs a patch of turf to rest its weary wheels for a few hours. We can understand where the owners are coming from, with all the overheads, rates, insurances etc that they are stuck with. But they have to understand where the Grey Nomads are coming from too, and if they could provide at a nominal cost an area of land which is safe and secure for a one or multiple night stop over that was without any facilities such as power, showers etc unless paid for as an extra, I’m sure there would be plenty who would not begrudge paying say $10 a night for the use of the area on which their vehicle was parked for the night. The result for them might then be that they gain an extra stream of income, with only the need to mow the grass periodically
Business big or small have to adjust to changing operational conditions. Big icon Aussie business have been wiped off the map due in part to not adapting to change. Businesses if big just can’t expect governments to financially help them out and the same applies to small businesses can’t expect local councils to “protect” them either.
Caravan parks are no different. The business model for parks of the 1970’s caravan that had a daily need for a caravan park is dead. Today’s vans are virtually a motel room on wheels and to expect caravanners to still pay for services they no longer require is robbery and travellers will not pay extortionist prices, they will look for cheaper and more suitable options.
If parks want caravanners patronage today they have to look at their needs and adjust their business model to suit.
Moving towards a user pay system will attract customers. Most vans today just need a water supply and a dump point and perhaps a bigger space and sometimes a little power.
Most vanners don’t mind paying for services they use and have respect for a reasonable margin for services provided.
Perhaps parks should look at a cost for each individual service or a combined cheaper price. There are parks that are moving to and indeed some have implemented a user pay system to attract customers back to parks.
There is a need for change.
I agree completely. Caravan parks , like all businesses must remain relevant to their market or they will go out of business. Simple as that. You cannot make the tail wag the dog.
spot on ! There is a PUB/PARK on the NW coast of Tas that offers FREE camping for vans and campers………HE IS DOING QUITE OK , THANK YOU. Half full EVERY night.
Mr Edmonds comment about the well documented fact that holiday park guests spend $1.39 locally for every dollar spent in the park is pure supposition. Just do the maths. At $50 per night that equates to $65 per day spent in the town. Do not insult our intelligence.
He did not say how much was spent by people camping for free near the same town.
Methinks these figures were supplied to him by the caravan parks ass.
Even free campers have to buy food fuel and clothes
Well that is just about the stupidist thing I have read. Where are grey nomads supposed to get all this extra money from? This is one of the most expensive countries in the world to live in and still nobody is satisfied with their income. If a caravan park has put in jumping pillows and playgrounds, then the demographic is families, not grey nomads. Why do I have to pay the infrastructure cost of play equipment, which I don’t use. Most grey nomads share their time between free camps and caravan parks. I am an early retiree, because of cancer. Nobody will employ me because of my limitations and complications of radiation oncology, Centrelink don’t feel I am sick enough to get anything from them, so I am using my super which is nearly gone. So where do I get this $20k a year just to sleep + fuel + food + insurance + medication etc etc. We are now selling our house to go on the road full time and we will share our time between free camping and caravan parks that we can afford. Attract me, don’t yell at me because your profits are dwindling and you’ve catered for the wrong crowd.
Well said. I believe the first few worfs of your last sentence summed it all up. “Attract me, don’t Yell at me. Pretty simple isn’t it. As I have said many times it would be like Coles orr Woolies putting a chain round our kneck, dragging us in and saying “there you will shop with us whether you like it or not” Just doesn’t work.
The caravan parks are ripping out camping site and replacing them with cabins and charging a fortune to use them and this is mostly happening on the prime coastal areas. We could not afford to travel in caravan parks all the time, but the outback towns that are struggling welcome us with reasonable prices at show grounds with amenities and water and power at some. We can afford to mix up free camping with these sites that range from $16-25 which great when you need to wash etc. we spend lots of money in these towns eating a meal or two out and usually top up the pantry and alcohol, so we feel like we really help these towns. We are sick of the winging caravan parks that don’t consider cheaper sites who don’t need all they charge for which is all we want
Correct ! Why give ONE person $400 a week when you could spread it around the town so ALL could gain some benefit. Just greed , greed , greed !
If you have a pet with you caravan parks only want to know you in the off season.you can’t get into caravan park with your pet in holiday season,so there’s no choice but to free camp
Most caravaners can’t ford to stay in caravan parks every night. Way too expensive. Most parks on the NSW coast have very few bays for caravans instead they have cabins. We have a 21 foot van and find some parks a squeeze.
If caravan parks did not charge as much then maybe some Grey Nomads might change their mind and camp in these parks.
To entice more clientele I think that they should have larger caravan sites, a free camping area for caravans (no power or water) and do away with the large trees in these free camping areas so that we can use our solar and satellite TV.
If these Caravan parks are so concerned about grey nomads and free campers then, why, are they reducing available sites by replacing them with cabins.
To me, they see car travellers as their income, not caravaners. They are attacking the motel/hotel trade for the available travellers dollar. Stand by for the next accommodation battle.
Yes, I understand that these parks and owners invest considerable funds to provide a service for the travelling public, but at what cost! The
Might I suggest a reasonable site rental, pay as you go power and fee for shower as an alternative to powered site fee. Very few of us use that much power between powered and unpowered sites.
This,again, leads to free camping.
Maybe the MOTEL industry will start complaining soon due to these caravan parks installing too many cabins which may detract from their establishments ??
The thing that gets me about Caravan parks is when you book in advance and on the day you turn up your site is in a shocking state. The grass needs mowing or the ground is not level, or you tell them you have a big van and they put you on a site that is so tight to get on. We usually book an ensuite site and have found that we can’t put our awning out because there isn’t enough room width wise to pull it out. It’s definitely not cheap to stay in caravan parks and they need to lift their game if they want Us travellers to stay in them. We have stayed in some great parks and paid high prices and had our bikes stollen from our annexe. The park had CCTV but had easy access for anyone to just walk into the park and help themselves to our things. So why the hell would we want to stay in these places and take the risk of losing stuff. We have paid up to $520 a week in a park just because it was a mining town. The site was a dust bowl and when it rained our annexe got flooded out and we were expected to pay that much a week all because the town was booming because of a gas plant. So I say drop your prices all year round get your parks up to scratch don’t cram people in so tight that you can hear the people in the van next to you bloody snoring. The shops need to also have an overhaul some of their prices are ridiculous and their produce is disgusting and they wonder why people don’t buy from their stores. Don’t blame us travellers do your research on the state and charges of your parks and then you might find the reason why we want free camping.
caravan Parks are the modern day equivalent of Butlins with its enforced entertainment, jollity and socialisation that people grew to realise they did not want. And where are they now?
The parks have to adjust to the trend, which is self contained vans that don’t need all the frills of caravan jails.
My and other businesses have to adjust to trends, just like retail with online markets, why not parks?
If I owned a park it would be on the market.
The industry has changed, suck it up and adapt.
I would consider Byron Bay to be an RV unfriendly town. There has certainly been many articles about the Council and free camping. I can’t find a free camp within coee of Byron Bay on Wickicamps so I don’t know why free campers are to blame for a loss of business.
I use a mixture of free camps, caravan parks and national parks. I prefer the wide open spaces to CP’s.
First there was video tape, the dvd followed by bluray, and now we stream content of the internet. The video store has gone the way of the dinosaur as technology has changed. Would a government legislate that we all had to use video tape and support video stores?
Caravans and motorhomes and camper trailers have changed and so have our needs. We are able to wander the wide expsanses of Australia because we have water, toilets and showers. There are very few caravans that must “plug in” to survive. Perhaps the caravan park is the “video” store of the RV scene.
As for legislation to force us into CP’s that will never work.
RV friendly is a movement that promotes freedom of choice. You could almost say that it is an attitude.
There are many RV travellers out there that cannot afford to stay in CP’s on a regular basis. Communities that provide an opportunity for those people, as well as those who want to use regulated facilities are the ones who are winning. The pub, the hardware store, the local shop, the butcher, the bakery, the fuel station all benefit from RV tourists.
How many outback towns survive on seasonal RV tourism. The argument that we don’t spend money in these places is ludicrous. Ingham’s experience with the CMCA low cost site show an average spend of $18,000 per month. (Council’s figures).
The bottom line is, if you want us to stay in a CP, give us a product we want, after all, we are the customer.
Agree with the earlier comments. Being on the road is (partly) about freedom, elbow-space, and to be able to enjoy Nature’s silence. Which is difficult if you are parked with other vans just a foot to either side of you in a caravan park. When you feel you need some fellowship, you go to a van park – when you want to be alone, you should be able to do that at free, uncrowded overnight stays, away from the “city lights”. And apart from this, it would not feel good to stay at a caravan park where the owners/managers are as bitter and criticizing as the ones in this article. As in all service industries; the vendor has to “earn” his/her customers, not begrudge that they are not using his/her business. Like it has been said above: “Cater to your potential customers, offer what they want, and they will come”.
So, so tired of the whingeing caravan park owners pleading poverty because the Grey Nomads don’t use their very expensive properties. You don’t hear the motels complaining about losing business to the parks putting in luxury cabins. Like many others along the coastal areas the Byron Holiday Park is way out of my price range at a starting price of $40 per night & I wonder what that goes up to in peak periods. My budget is $15 to $25. I also travel with my medium sized dog & although they say they are pet friendly they only take small dogs. Considering my dog is better behaved than many children & many small dogs are snappy, yappy little buggers (I’ve had 2 Chihuahuas), I don’t see the logic. Bottom line is I mostly use Showgrounds & the smaller friendly caravan parks to fit my budget & my best mate.
As we live on a pension ONLY, we dont have big super, we cannot afford to stay at overpriced caravan parks. This is Australia where we are supposed to have free choice and free speech but organisations such as caravan parks want to take that away from us too. As for supporting local communities when we free camp I am not sure where caravan parks get their information from but we have been travelling for 20 years and the communities we visit have a different tale to tell. They are greatly supported by free campers. So be very careful caravan parks because limiting our free camping doesnt mean we will be forced to stay in your parks, just the opposite in fact. By the way we do stay in reasonably priced caravan parks on our travel all of which are run by people who can’t do enough for those on the road on limited budgets.
I find it interesting that small country towns are putting in free camp spot with services to encourage grey nomads to stop in their town and mainly the east coast caravan parks are complaining. On our recent trip on the Queensland coast we had great difficulty finding a spot for two vans in caravans parks on the coast and when you do you pay a premium. I love the small country town and support them when we stay in their free camps, I also stay in caravan parks at time especially when we want a long stay surely there is room for both.
Stop watching Getaway on tv and thinking everyone travelling wants top of the range everything they just promote these places because they get to stay there for free and if caravan parks don’t change they will just end up the same as the video shops have, change with the times or go broke.
Are they going to stop people sewing their own curtains at home instead of paying to get them done? Are they going to cut their own hair and not go to a hairdresser? The list goes on and on. What a bunch of whiners. They just don’t get it. We prefer to stay in the free and low cost areas because we don’t want the camp kitchen. We don’t want the jumping castle and the children’s playground. We don’t want the swimming pool and water slides. And to top it all off. Caravan parks are not treating us properly. All they are interested in is the cabin trade. They are spending their money on all I have mentioned and not spending money on sites and amenities as well as the cleaning of such being sub standard. I only stay in a caravan park if I have to. I don’t like hearing everything from the van next door and feeling packed in like a sardine. So wake you you people and realise…we simply don’t want you.
We enjoy csmping in an attractive place where we are not crowded together like sardines – that is why we like national parks snd some free camps. Being forced to stay in a caravan park at an exhorbitant cost is simply not fair. Its like being told we can’t use internet shopping but have to buy from a retail shop. There should be choice – some people like staying in commercial caravan parks and others are self-contained and dont want the facilities and tiny sites. We stayed recently at Laura and Normanton where it cost $20 a night for unpowered sites and we were quite happy to pay that for use of their facilities. It just doesnt make sense to pay exhorbitant prices for the rent of a piece of land and some water because a company wants to make huge profits by forcing oeople to use their product.
I paid over $300 a week for a caravan park in North Queensland, just enough room for van and annex, could hear everything neighbours said, we were that close and there was no room to park the car. Had park out front and move it every time someone left orvarrived at the spot next to me. No wonder we prefer free camps
She’s loosing $3000 a night, Poor dear, at 3000 a night for 365 days a year that’s 1,095,000. No wonder that millionaire CP owner is angry. Yes, coin in the slot power and showers would suit me and solve the problem.
Jan, when , if not already, you go to Tasmania, spend a couple of weeks at St Helens. Go to Swimcart Beach…..free camping for at least 40-50 vans, heaps of tent camping, terrific little town which is absolutely thriving due to same AND two coin in the slot shower areas. Am heading back for a couple of months in Nov.
Money money its a rich man world
Perhaps consider the needs of the grey nomads ….. we don’t need playgrounds , bouncy castles or even swimming pools so why should we have to pay for these ?
Very well said, Carolyn
Why dont’ the CP’s that are whinging do what the Water Ski Club in Mulwala NSW has just started doing by charging $15 pn in the off season. Would be comparable with Showground fees but with better facilities if that’s campers prefer.
Totally agree with the many comments saying that a major reason people like to fre camp is because caravan parks (and particularly council run parks) change far too much and provide things that with neither want nor need. And parks that complain that they have made big investment etc, well so have we – in solar panels, water tanks etc so we want to free camp to get our money’s worth. Also, we support the comments about parks packing people in like sardines whereas often at a free camp, you can have your own space. Also, it’s great not to have to leave by 10am. The government, in particular local government, should be providing more free-camps, not less, to cater for the modern grey nomad.
Would like to see the stats on these statements.Are they van sites or total accommodation. Airbnb will be having a major impact on their cabins in the coastal areas, so it is easier to pick on the poor old Grey Nomads.
They say that free camping is costing them a fortune. Well fancey that. Their attitude is costing grey nomads a fortune. But thats ok Nomads have the last laugh word of mouth at free camps
The bottom line is if we have to pay the price the park owners are asking then alot of grey nomads won’t be doing the big lap. I know last time we went around the budget ran out before the fortnight. Having the option free camp ensured that we could keep going without dipping into our capital. I Agree with most of the above about having areas in caravan parks for grey nomads with the basics – water, toilets, dump point… power optional and charging less would attract more into caravan park s. My days of jumping on bouncing pillows is over…. not a good look at my age. Look out NSW , if you bring this in, most grey nomads will give your state a miss.
More and more caravan parks are putting in cabins reducing the amount of powered sites. Secondly they are charging to much for a site. Is it any wonder we look for free camps
It never stops does it ? The greed of the caravan parks has to catch up with them sooner or later. Its simple spend your dollars elsewhere.Thats what we do.
Lets take it to the next step…..CPs are offering a “cheaper alternative to the hotels and motels,,,maybe the CPs should be reduced and regulated more closely because hotels and motels are suffering from high vacancy rates too….As everyone above has stated, not too many Grey Nomads use Bouncy Castles, tennis courts etc,,our needs are far simpler….its like choosing a dining place…you go where you can afford….hence the preference for free camping It really is a no brainer…more people who can “afford” to be in an area will spend in that area…..or do these areas prefer them to move on?
“The New South Wales Crown Holiday Parks Trust – which oversees the operation of 36 coastal and inland holiday parks and several recreation reserves on Crown Land – is the latest to add its voice to those calling for a crackdown. The organisation’s CEO, Steve Edmonds, said free campers were costing commercial parks a small fortune.”
Righto Mr Edmonds…its on!…how dare you. The fact is it is the caravan parks that are costing many travelers a small fortune…not the other way around. MY van is fully self contained, and I enjoy to free camp in many outback locations. However in some towns we have no choice but to use a caravan park. We have just spent a weekend at a superb caravan aprk on the Sunshine coast, a prime lcoation, and the workers were the friendliest people ever, the facilities spotless, and its a pleasure to pay to stay in a prk with security, clean facilities, and friendly staff….but that is not always the case, and there is NO way I would bother with a caravan if I had to spend over $50 every night just on park fees…so, what is it to be…No Free camping and fewer caravans,..and everyone looses out….Steve Edmonds…you are 180 degrees wrong..free camping is part of caravanning…, and we are told that caravan sales have not yet peaked in Australia…so stop whinging, and focus on marketing clean parks with good security, reasonable fees and caravans will come….and free campers will free camp
Around 2008 i took the family to tassie for a few weeks with our van,
on the way we pulled into a cp at lakes entrance for the night, $70 for one night !! never again.
There was a national survey done 2/3 years ago that showed free campers spent money all over towns they stayed in such as the butchers,greengrocers,coffee shops etc and not just to caravan park owners. We live on the road permently as my medication is not covered by the pbs ( hopefully one day) and we could not afford to keep our home. There is no way we could afford their fees that are mostly over $30 a day for a bit of dirt and water and electricity I will just bypass towns that don’t have free camping no grat loss to me their is still plenty of this country to see.
Would be nice to see a response from Caravan manufacturers ,part suppliers and all other associated businesses that make money from caravaners As the ridiculous money grabbing in some parks must have an effect surely at some point on the sale of caravan and other items which will drop off ,hurting another industry.
Maybe the government, “do we actually have one” look into the exhorbitant rising cost of the hospitality industry .As per usual it comes down to greed
Hi Mr Edmonds, you and your organisation are complaining about free parks taking money away from Caravan Parks. Even if this is the case don’t you think you are being very hyprocritical as you and your parks are taking accommodation away from hotels & motels. If you want to sound at all convincing get rid of all cabins out of all caravan parks that are more than $50 per night. Then and only then, will you have any sort of legimate claim to try & stop free camping. In the meantime get off your bike & stop the Bulls..t & live & let live. If caravan parks want free campers business they have to supply what we want at a price we can afford to pay. We dont want jumpinfg pillows, we don’t want to be squashed in like sardines etc. Caravan Parks have expanded their business (Cabins etc) taking business away from others and put their prices up and are now complaing they are also loosing business from powered sites. You can’t have your cake & eat it too.
Caravan parks are only one business in a town. A lot of other businesses in the town gain from people being able to save on free camping and spend that money elsewhere. I definitely don’t want to pay high fees to use a bit of power and water.
When I need or want a caravan park, I have a cut off limit on price. This is mainly due to not wanting to be ripped off. I know exactly how much power and water my van uses and to be forced to pay the prices most of these deluded caravan park operators ask is ludicrous. Where possible, if a town doesn’t offer free or low cost pull up (I don’t consider I’m camping) I ensure I spend as little as possible anywhere in town and vice versa for the towns that offer it. Byron won’t be getting a cracker off me at the prices and sizes they are. Seems caravan parks are stuck in the mindset of the 60s and 70s and just want to charge like people are on their annual 2 weeks holidays per year and don’t care what they pay for those two weeks. Time to realise how times and vans have changed. I’d like to spend more time in parks if they suited me better; much fairer prices for what I need, no snooty people on reception looking down their nose at you or getting all controlling, flexible hours, easier access and a definite drive through site (not charged extra for) so you don’t have to unhook and rehook in your valuable working time in the park, single rates if you charge an extra person rate and my list goes on. So best they familiarise themselves with what is required these days.
Well as usual there are 2 sides to consider. The Byron Park owner may need to consider what she can do to entice people back – maybe a worthwhile discount for multiple nights. Its a similar case with Uber & Taxis. Regulated v unregulated. Taxis pay for licences etc – Uber bugger,all. The motel industry vs Air bnb. Motels have council & fire inspections, insurances etc – Air BNB nothing. That may changes if an airbnb is gutted by fire & people are incinerated. It is true though, as pointed out by Ian how many Nomads are going to be rushing down to the jumping pillows? Maybe the nightly charge should be based on what facilities are used
Oh….and one thing I forgot to mention is when I do need and go into a caravan park….it’s only ever in a community that also allows free camping. Those town that hunt free campers away never get my business in the parks. I’m needing to go into a park shortly and am saving it up for two towns away that offer a 96 hour free camp and a single rate. Also my gas purchases will be saved for that town.
Unbelievable Caravan parks. If us grey nomads had to pay your fee of 40 to 50 dollars a night which equal around 700 dollars a fortnight we would not be travelling at all. How much do you think pensioners get, really..? Get a grip on life and the real world. The blessings of Free camping at least give us a bit of quality of life so we don,t have to sit at home watching tv. You. Will think a bit differently when you are old and not being money hungry. We do spend a lot of our pension in the towns that provide free camping. We still have to eat and buy fuel, repairs etc.
We have recently stayed at 2 camps in tiny West Australian towns that we brilliant. Westonia, $15/night and almost new. 9 km off the main road and Salmon Gums the same price and wonderful. Clean ablutions, fresh water and power. Both are very small.
Camp sites run on crown land, for the people, should not be for profit. They should cover them selves only.
much cheaper if you plan to free camp more. A budget of $1000 per week is realistic for those caravanning the way we have.